Does Jon & Kate Plus 8 Violate Child Labor Laws?

I just recently started watching the TLC show Jon And Kate Plus 8.  The Gosselins seem to be all over the place, but in case you don't know the premise, they have a set of twins and a set of sextuplets and the show is about their "daily lives."

And there has been some backlash from it.

Some of it is kind of basic: they are exploiting their children for money and fame and free stuff and the same kind of nonsense mommybloggers get.  But then an interesting question was raised.  Do these children being filmed in their home violate child labor laws?

The answer is, I don't know.  Reality TV is a relatively new media.  The kids are certainly not working a job in the traditional sense.  They are not in sweat shops and factories as was the case when child labor laws were created.

The idea is that these children are being filmed in their home setting.  They are not working, they are just going about their daily lives.  With a film crew, production managers, set designers, etc. etc. In their home.

We all know enough about reality TV now to know that this is not reality.  Stuff is set up.  Stuff is staged.  And the children and the parents are interviewed on the show.  Are they working?  Sure?  Are they being paid?  I don't know, I'm sure Jon and Kate are.  If the kids are being paid it would be in a trust and I've seen no discussion of a trust.  In fact, Jon and Kate claim the kids don't have college funds although that may not be true.

I don't think that the filming of these children violate child labor laws as they stand now.  But, should new laws be written to protect children on reality shows?

Comments

[Amy H]

I don't see how it could violate child labor laws. They aren't really working. Being interviewed by a cameraman every once in a while isn't exactly my idea of work.

Now what this does to them psychologically is a different story all together. Personally I can't watch the show because all I hear is a bunch of screaming kids and I get enough of that in my own reality.

[chatty cricket]

Doesn't it also matter how many hours per day they are "working?" Are the cameras on them ALL DAY? I don't watch the show (LOL Amy H, I totally agree), so I don't know.

Kids on reality shows is a tricky subject....Jon and Kate Plus 8 seems a more reasonable example of a reality show featuring children than does say, Denise Richards' show which is exploitative on it's best day. But then again, so is she in her general life. However, since I don't watch either show, maybe I shouldn't jump to any conclusions?

[b]

What I see is two people trying to find a way to earn enough to raise 8 kids, 6 of which are all the same age. I tend not to judge them b/c I have no idea what the hell I'd do if I were in their shoes.

[Amalah]

I don't watch this show either, but if the parents are claiming that the kids don't have college funds...well, that's disturbing. Because at least there are some laws now to protect the wages of child stars -- trusts and other safeguards to ensure that there's SOMETHING for them once they turn 18.

Reality TV is different, but I know enough about this show to know that it has certainly catapulted the kids into a type of star/celebrity status, and it does seem like, if the parents are earning $ from the show itself, at least a decent chunk of that SHOULD be set aside for the children to have one day, in the form of a trust or college fund.

(I've read about all the donations and gifts the parents get for the daily care and expenses of the kids, which...fine, that's their money to do as they see fit, since it's not like they've gone and claimed charity non-profit status or something, but money from the show? Just seems fair that the kids get some of it one day to do as THEY see fit.)

[Isabel]

Those links...

HOLY TIME SUCK.

And now I must get some work done.

AHHHHHHHHHHH!

[Shamelessly Sassy]

I will admit that I watch this show. There's another site about them too. It's allegedly Jodi's sister talking smack about how she won't be on the show anymore, because Kate didn't want her to have a contract or be paid. (And the fact that I know all of this makes me puke in my mouth a little.) I think this is it:
http://truthbreedshatred.blogspot.com/

[jp]

I like the show. It makes me feel better about my life and only having 2 children. :)

(also, I think the child labor issue is pushing it a little.)

[meerkatsrock]

i've only seen the show just a couple of times. i would like to think the child labor laws are reserved, in regards to tv, for people (or children), who play roles (other than themselves), and need to remember speaking lines, etc. the gosselin children are going about their daily routine, possibly unaware they are even being recorded. i don't think that violates and child labor laws. as for the money, i'm sure with eight kids there's not a whole lot of "extra" money floating around, but it certainly wouldn't hurt to start putting some money away for their kids future.

[Manda]

Keep in mind, when you have a baby on a set, who may only be lying in a bassinet, doing usual stuff babies do, being themselves, they arent technically 'working' by acting out or memorizing lines, but there are limits to the amount of time they can spend on the set.

And for those of you who may not know it, studio lighting is installed in every room of the house except Jon and Kate's bedroom.

[hellothere]

Yes, studio lighting is installed and there were hidden cameras in the sextuplets' bedrooms, just to name a few things.

Also, they aren't just "going about their everyday lives" --They are driving 75 miles to make cupcakes (which the boys were then denied, and it was part of their birthday celebration), being dragged hither thither and yon when they are sick because production calls for it, being filmed while Daddy pulls an impaction out of a little bottom, etc.

All in a day's work? Lovely.

[Elsa]

Child actors are not protected by the Fair Labor Standards Act, so it's up to each state to make those laws themselves. The best are -- not surprisingly -- in California. Some states actually advertise the fact that they have no restrictions on the number of hours children -- even infants -- may work. I think these laws are important. While you would hope that the parents are looking out for their child's best interest, there is the risk that they will be blinded by the money and swayed by those whose true interests lie not in the best welfare of the children, but in how much money can be made off them.

I think this is what has happened to Jon and Kate. The children cannot help but be aware they are being filmed ... there are cameras in their faces, filming their most private moments (including toileting and bathing), and boom mikes hovering over their heads. They have cameras in their bedrooms and studio lights installed in the ceiling of their home. They are taken on outings that are getting more and more contrived as the producers struggle to fill their shooting schedule (reportedly 40 episodes next year).

As for extra money, in addition to whatever they are being paid by TLC, Jon and Kate have endorsement deals with several major brands (Gap, Gymboree, and Juicy Juice spring to mind), and are gone at least two weekends per month as they give speeches to churches at which they relate the story of their trials and pass the plate for a "love offering". Jon has apparently stopped working outside the home altogether, while according to Jodi's sister's blog, they now have a staff that includes a personal assistant, people to do their laundry (originally volunteers, but they seem to have disappeared), an organic chef, and a lawn service, and a nanny. It is not a big leap to say that they have gone from trying to earn a little "extra money" to exploiting their children for financial gain.

[chatty cricket]

Isabel wasn't kidding- holy time suck!!

As I said above, I don't watch the show, and now having read a lot of these links and "behind the scenes" stories, I can't imagine ever wanting to. Elsa, I read a lot of those same things about the staff.

How many years has this show been on, anyway?

[helenel]

I didn't know about the studio lights and contrived visits. Ick.

Are the kids on "Little People, Big World" in the same boat? Or Supernanny or any of the other reality shows about families? How odd that almost all of the above shows feature multiples in their families.

It makes me think of the Dionne quintuplets. Only this is on television instead of people trooping to watch them through windows while they play. At least Jon and Kate are making decisions for them, instead of their government.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dionne_quintuplets

[unbelievable]

"Jon has apparently stopped working outside the home altogether, while according to Jodi's sister's blog, they now have a staff that includes a personal assistant, people to do their laundry (originally volunteers, but they seem to have disappeared), an organic chef, and a lawn service, and a nanny. It is not a big leap to say that they have gone from trying to earn a little "extra money" to exploiting their children for financial gain."

This makes me so angry. And people say "I couldn't do it, how does she do it? I'm in no position to judge her since it must be so hard to care for eight children!" Disgusting.

[Manda]

There are actually a lot of parallels to the Dionne Quints if you think of it in the context of today's standards versus the standards back then. True, the government doesnt have control of them, but a child exploited for monetary gain is a child exploited for monetary gain. And I'm not only pointing fingers at the parents. There are production companies, staff, TLC, advertisers, product endorsements making big bucks off these kids. Of course, the parents DO bear the brunt of the responsibility here, but it would appear they are just as enamoured with the perks of the business as any executive with a horse in this race.

What price do you put on the head of your child to display their most private moments, potty time, emotional outbursts and such documented for a lifetime? Free hair plugs and a tummy tuck, ski trips and spa days? Hope its going to be worth it twenty years from now, but I think the surviving Dionne quints would argue that opinion. The difference between now and then is that back then, people traveled to see the quints at Quintland. Today, the Gosselin kids come straight through our cable to the middle of our living room. How convenient.

"For nine years the quintuplets lived in a sort of theme park know as "Quintland", to which about three million tourists came to observe them through a one-way screen. The little girls became a major visitor attraction for the province of Ontario, bringing in an estimated $250 million dollars per year in today's dollars (The Dionnes by Ellie Tesher).

As the sisters would later write in the book We Were Five, "There was so much more money than love in our existence. It took a long time to realize what it did to us all."

http://www.heroines.ca/people/dionne.html

[Cara]

Wow, I see there is often nothing as vicious as judgmental parents. I watch and am a fan of the show, and what I see is a family that could have struggled, but found a way to use their situation to benefit the family. I see so much of myself and my husband in Jon and Kate and can related to many instances. I have also de-pooped my daughter in the back of the van and denied her a special treat because she did not eat her dinner (gasp)! The comparison to the Dionne situation is really unfair, these kids live in their home with parents that love them deeply and are surrounded by people that love them. Just like the mommy blogs I read, I feel lucky to be able to catch a glimpse into the lives of others and be able to cry, laugh and scream with them.

[Dew]

Cameras in those poor children's faces day after day is not benefiting those children.

"Do these children being filmed in their home violate child labor laws? The answer is, I don't know."

It is not a question of does it violate, it is a question of should there be a law that it violates. I think the answer is clear from what those children are being dragged through to make dozens upon dozens of episodes of this show without so much as a summer hiatus.

[CharmingDriver]

I only recently caught a marathon of the show and am not ashamed to say I fell in serious love with the kids. Jon's passivity would make me want to stand on his neck and Kate's controlling nature is everything I loathe about myself staring back at me but end of the day: They make it work with 8 kids and if that means help, thank goodness they have it.

[voila]

Cara said, "I see so much of myself and my husband in Jon and Kate and can related to many instances."

...and therein, my friend, lies the problem.

[Jayne]

The children may not be working in the sense of what adults consider work, but they are being used to promote, parcel and package, a television show about their lives and their parents. Regardless of the show being scripted or not, those kids are "working" in the sense that they are a part of the show about them. If any money is being passed around, they should get some and it should be put into a trust fund for them. They earned it by growing up with the cameras, withstanding the 24/7 studio lighting and hidden cameras (reminds me of the Truman show a bit). It is a shame that there aren't more laws to protect stage children and the child labor laws are to vague in this area (at least in my state).

[chatty cricket]

you know, someone on one of the blogs I got sucked into yesterday (maybe it was Gosselins without pity) brought up a GREAT point:

The older girls are in school, and are certainly at an age where their peers can be aware of what's going on on the show. How does it make the older twins feel to know that their most intimate and emotional moments are being filmed and put on TV for anyone to see? Who would ever want that for their children? Kids deserve privacy and protection, and the twins are being unfairly put out there in every manner imaginable, by the two people who should be able to protect them, and the sextuplets are up next.

Where do draw the line as a parent, I think is the big question. Sure, they're "making it work" by getting paid for a show on TLC, but is it really in the best interest of the children? Jon and Kate are old enough to decide that they want to air their lives on television, but I think it's completely ufair of them to make the same decision on behalf of their children. There are myriad ways to "make it work" that don't include putting your children's potty training and bath time and highly emotional moments on television. What is going to happen to these children as they grow up? I think they're going to be highly affected.

We may have all been in similar parenting situations, because we're all parents, but Cara, when you depooped your daughter in the back of the minivan, did you call everyone over to watch and then get a check from Huggies? Probably not. It would have seemed like an invasion of her privacy, right?

[jodifur]

I was a little nervous about this post because I know people feel really passionate about this show, both positive and negative. Thanks for playing nice and being civil! MamaPop readers are awesome!

[Mama]

Would you say that Denise Richards is working in being on her reality show? Are Jon and Kate working by being on the TV show? I believe that they are.

Then the children are working since they are doing many if not all of the same things. If it is not Jon and Kate's regular daily life just with camaras, then it isn't a regular life for the children either.

[linda in nm]

Jon and Kate are paid $65,000 per episode. I see on an internet site that reality stars are paid $750 - $5,000 per episode. Does that mean that children get paid individually? Is that money put in separate accounts in trust for them? J&K say they have no college funds for the children.

In addition to the show, J&K get paid expenses and an honorarium to do speaking gigs. They have stopped doing small churches because they aren't financially lucrative enough. They now do venues of 1,300 or so that sell tickets for up to $15 each. In addition, they pass the hat for "love donations" at each event. They also sell family photos for $10 each. They can easily come away with $30,000 or more for each appearance.

There is another question in my mind regarding all the freebies. Say take the free tummy tuck which can cost upwards of $10,000 particularly with a fancy NY surgeon. The IRS would consider that a gift if advertising were not given in exchange. Dr. Glassman is featured on the J&K website and his name has been mentioned on the program. Hence the IRS looks upon this as a BARTER and as such should be included in their taxable income.

Other products like Huggies [packs seen on the program], the jewelry K wears, the bibs, the bakery that they went to, furniture store, etc., the Gap and the tee-shirt lady all are barters and the freebies should be declared by them as taxable. That goes for the cars/vans as well as the car seats, cribs, free new bikes, etc.

Also included should be the upgrades to their house that the studio has installed -- lighting, hidden cameras, custom blinds, etc.

Then there is the issue of the organic chef. Was he hired because the workers were hungry and K didn't feed them? Are the lawnworkers there because the crew want them?

I cannot believe that both Beth and Jodi were never paid for their help. Jodi, in particular, watched the children several times a week even though she had her own 4. Did K ever reciprocate?

I feel that they are violating a lot of tax laws and could be in trouble if someone blows the whistle.

This show should be taken off the air.

Jon no longer works outside of the house. He stays home to help poor exhausted K who sleeps in until 8 in the morning. He gets the kids up, fed and off to school and then makes all the beds. He is also the bathgiver at 6 p.m. and puts the kids to bed.

K used to have volunteers to come in and fold the laundry, put it away and iron it. What did she do during the day?

This show should be taken off the air and no reruns should be run as it focusses on a family where child abuse takes place. It is simply a way for the Gosselins to get rich off their children. Their family is now making do with 4,000 square feet and soon they are moving into their McMansion which no doubt will be furnished with freebies.

PA and the IRS should be getting their share. Who pays for the health insurance now that J is not working? Does PA provide health insurance for children -- poor children like the megamillion Gosselins?

[Laney]

The kids, the family, are not filmed everyday. That's even said in the show a couple of times. For instance, Jon's surprise birthday to the Florida Keys (which, without the show, they probably never could have afforded) Kate said the cameras had to leave because Jon would know something was going on if they were there.

I don't know this for sure, but I'm guessing TLC pays for many/all of the outings they go on. If TLC wasn't there, these kids may not have had the opportunities they get to go places and do things. A family of 4 can take a museum trip for granted, but I bet Jon and Kate know exactly how lucky they are to have these opportunities.

Another big thing is you can tell that the production staff for the show really love the family. On many reality shows staff isn't allowed to interact with the people but this show is different. They know when they can react with the kids and when t not. You can hear the staff laughing in the background when someone does something funny or hear them talking back to the kids when they ask them questions. I think they handle everything delicately and nicely.